1. Should landscaping come first or the fence?
The order which is done first can have an impact on the finished result and overall cost. Each company would say that they should be first but there are some fundamental reasons why at least some components of your fence should be a completed first. The drilling and the placing of concrete in the posts is a very messy procedure with equipment, piles of dirt coming out of the hole and possible concrete spillage. This is something that will negatively affect finished landscapes as fresh sod will get a lot of extra heavy traffic.
Another item that is difficult to control is grade. By having the fence installed first, the landscaping can be brought perfectly to the bottom of the fence every inch around the property. The same cannot be said for it the 8 or 10’ long straight board that is installed after the undulating landscaping is done. We work together with a few landscapers in order to provide the customer with the best possible finished product. If scheduling is a problem, then at the very least, drilling and setting of the posts should be done before the landscaping is started.
In order to make the process as smooth and as cost efficient as possible, we would prefer to work with the landscaper rather than incur additional costs and grief for the Owner
2. Do I need to set the posts with concrete or is packed dirt or gravel good?
Concrete is the only option for a solid and straight fence for many years. The concrete converts the effective size of the post to the size of the hole. The square inches resisting the post from moving side to side are considerably more when the post and the 12” diameter concrete base act as one. That’s not to say if something is temporary or doesn’t need to be 100% solid or plumb (like a bird feeder post), then installation can be made with dirt or gravel.
And no, sprinkling in some cement powder or dry ready mix concrete c/w some topping of water is not acceptable concrete as some companies do. If this worked so well, we could just shovel some gravel on the grass, cover with cement powder and water it until a sidewalk appeared. But it won’t.
3. Isn’t it better to put free draining gravel in the hole?
A common concern is to have the material right next to the post be a product that drains the water away from the post so that the post does not rot as fast. If there was somewhere for the water to go to unrestricted, like through a pipe to a drain, then that might make sense. The moisture content of the soil will be the same as the concrete and the same as the wood post that is underground so concrete is still the better material.
4. How long should I expect my fence to last?
That is an obviously impossible question to answer but a chart of what to expect is as follows.
2-4 years This should be about the time for the second coat of stain after construction. The stain from the initial construction is well worn from the elements and the visual imperfections are definitely are showing. A second coat now will fill all of the micro cracks that have appeared as the cellular moisture content of the wood is much lower since when it was new. Staining should be every 4-7 years depending on the owners taste.
5-10 years If non PT materials are buried in mulch, dirt or anything that retains moisture, wood will rot well within this time frame. Sacrificial PT wood can be placed up against the fence to retain these materials if need be but the best solution is to not have the fence that low in the ground to begin with.
15-20 years This would be an easy expectation as a minimum for the fence to last with little to no maintenance including painting.
25+ years A properly installed rough sawn spruce fence should last in excess of 25 years. We have completed the demo of 40 year old fences that were taken care of and they were in very reasonable condition for the age. 6×6 posts were also not used very much 40 years ago so average age for today’s fence might even be getting longer! In general, if the fence is showing exposed wood or just looks like it needs a fresh coat of stain, do it. It will look great and will last much longer.
5. Is it better to use all pressure treated material in my fence instead of the regular spruce wood?
To compare spruce versus pressure treated (PT) spruce, all things being equal, the PT material is superior. The “rough sawn” spruce is an option that many developments specify and that is similar to the apple an orange comparison. The rough 1×6 board will be a full 1” of material versus the approximately 5/8” of the pressure treated board so it results in a stiffer and straighter fence. Another consideration is regarding the application of a solid colour stain. The rough board has a texture that allows the stain to adhere far better than the smooth boards. Some people are under the impression that the pressure treated fences do not need to be painted or stained. This is very false as pressure treated will turn from green to gold in the first 2 years and then from gold to clear and finally after 4-6 years turn grey. The grey is a sign of decay beginning. Another concern some people have is that the rough spruce after staining can be very rough to the touch and the smooth board may be better in that situation. If a rough sawn fence is coating with a stain every 4-7years as part of basic maintenance, it will last just as long.
6. How can I locate my property lines?
Most fence contractors will stipulate in your contract that it is the property owner’s responsibility to identify the property line.
There are a few things you can do to locate the property lines. In Alberta, if you have bought your home recently, you will have received a copy of what is called a Real Property Report (RPR). This report was made by a surveyor and will have the measurements of your property and it may also have the distances from the corners of a building to the property lines. This report is the least expensive and quickest way to locate the line.
You could look (dig) for the survey pins. If you live in a newer area there should be survey pins in the ground to mark the corners of your property. However, this is probably the least efficient method to locate the property line as these pins could be up to 12 inches down in some cases and there is now guarantee that they will be there or that you will find them.
You could call a survey company and have someone come out and mark the lines for you. There will be a charge for this service (a couple hundred dollars in Alberta).
7. Where exactly does the fence go on the property line?
A property line is infinitely thin yet your fence can be almost 10” thick, depending on design. The guideline that we use is a range of + or – 6” off of the property line for the fence to be constructed. That gives a 12” wide strip up the property to be in regardless of what side of the fence is of concern.
Commercial fence locations are the same for private property to private property but are different when private property borders City property. In this case, the edge of the fence is usually set 150mm (6”) inside the private property.
8. What kind of stain or paint should I use?
We use products for Cloverdale Paint which has a number of locations around the city. The products they use are of the highest quality we can buy. The quality is such that the at least 90% of the fencing industry specifies and uses their product. Most subdivisions use solid hide stain product called Weather One.
9. Can I do anything to bring the cost of the fence down?
Most contractors will give quantity discounts. Therefore, the first thing you can do is increase the quantity of fence. That does not mean put up more fences around you property but rather, talk with your neighbors or anyone you know in your neighborhood that may need a fence. Group together and then approach a contractor for one high volume, low price. This is by far the most effective strategy for lowering the price tag and this strategy works because it enables the fence contractor to reduce setup and travel costs during the build.
If the dirt tailings that come out of the post hole need to be cleaned up, then this task can done simply with a shovel and a wheel barrow. This task alone is worth up to $1.50/LF
Not staining your fence might not be a huge money saver but it can definitely be a good thing to defer for a few months or year. It does cut our cost by $6-8/LF and depending on your personal situation, can be done by the owner or any neighbor any time!
This next suggestion may not at first glance sound like a way to save money, but in many cases it can be. We have had to clean up a few messes for customers left behind by dishonest and /or incompetent fence contractors. This could be prevented by choosing your contractor wisely; sometimes the lowest price shouldn’t win because in most cases you get what you pay for.
10. Do I have to let my neighbor know about building the fence?
Some people have approached us about building their fence only to have some really irate neighbors come out and either get really mad or even shut the work down. It always makes sense to involve your neighbor and let them know what you are doing well before we arrive on site, even if you want to pay for everything.
Some neighbors want a contractor to build the whole thing while a number of people want to take on the task themselves and that can pose a challenge. Home owner/DIY quality can vary greatly and the guarantee for those that just want it done right is an issue. Try to see if they can show you some previous work before they start working on the fence. In a lot of cases, by the time you add up retail material costs, labor in painting and installing, tool purchases or rentals and numerous trips to the hardware store, the cost to have a professional fence company come in and do the job, isn’t that much more. This is something that can be discussed with somebody who wants to do it themselves.